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Author Topic: Adrenal Fatigue & Anxiety ?  (Read 377 times)

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Offline anxious J

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Adrenal Fatigue & Anxiety ?
« on: January 26, 2014, 01:21:22 PM »
Is Adrenal Fatigue the main course for anxiety ? I was also looking into the Ssri Meds and it shows that they cause the adrenals to increase cortisol levels which surely aint good if trying to Recover from Adrenal fatigue ? Also Few studies Show that Ssri leads to Lower Bone mineral Density is This Possible and is it caused by the Increase in cortisol from the ssri's ? I am pretty Sure that if I can Treat My Adrenal Fatigue then clear up most if not all My Anxiety Problems But how ? Have tried many Natural alternative with absolutely no help what so ever !
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Offline insights

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Re: Adrenal Fatigue & Anxiety ?
« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2014, 07:20:38 PM »
Is Adrenal Fatigue the main course for anxiety ?

No. Inhibition of brain cell budding and growth and cell destruction in the hippocampal areas of the brain by chronic stress hormone exposure probably is.

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I was also looking into the Ssri Meds and it shows that they cause the adrenals to increase cortisol levels

No, they don't. Depending on which study you read they either don't affect cortisol levels or reduce them (Hernandez ME, 2013; Dziurkowska E, 2013; Keating C, 2013).

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which surely aint good if trying to Recover from Adrenal fatigue ?


What evidence do you have that your adrenal glands aren't working correctly? There is no medical evidence that "adrenal fatigue" is a real disorder.

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Also Few studies Show that Ssri leads to Lower Bone mineral Density is This Possible and is it caused by the Increase in cortisol from the ssri's ?


Yes, antidepressants may affect bone density though the evidence doesn't seem strong. Anxiety and depression also cause bone loss. If SSRIs do affect bone density then it it likely to be due to their affect on serotonin binding sites within bone cells rather than through cortisol.

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I am pretty Sure that if I can Treat My Adrenal Fatigue then clear up most if not all My Anxiety Problems But how ? Have tried many Natural alternative with absolutely no help what so ever !

Which is probably telling you that your problem isn't 'adrenal fatigue.'  If you want to regrow hippocampal brain cells your best shot is either antidepressants or the cognitive and/or behavioural and/or mindfulness therapies. We know these work.

Ian
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NOTE: I'm not a doctor, and particularly not yours, so there may be factors I'm unaware of. Therefore all advice is of a general nature and you should consult your doctor before following any of it, especially before changing med doses.

Offline anxious J

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Re: Adrenal Fatigue & Anxiety ?
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2014, 07:14:00 PM »
Hi Ian Thanks for Replying, Is the any studies that Show that stress Hormones Cause Long term Damage to the hippocampal Areas of The Brain ? Or that Ssri Stimulate the regrowth of New brain Cells & If so by which Mechanism Do the ssri/anti-anxiety meds do this ?

Here is a study on Ssri Increasing cortisol http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=23509222

Do all antidepressants have the abilty to cause Bone Loss i ask as I had a bone density Scan which showed Osteopenia in spine and didnt want to make it any worse ?

I have tried Cbt Which has made me more aware that all my problems are anxiety But can't seem to use the techniques to over come my Anxiety.

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Offline insights

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Re: Adrenal Fatigue & Anxiety ?
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2014, 10:16:12 PM »
Is the any studies that Show that stress Hormones Cause Long term Damage to the hippocampal Areas of The Brain ?

Sure, lots of them.

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Or that Ssri Stimulate the regrowth of New brain Cells

Yep, hundreds of them. Also Google: antidepressants+neurogenesis

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If so by which Mechanism Do the ssri/anti-anxiety meds do this ?

That is still being determined, but some of the studies linked to above will give you an idea of the possible mechanisms.

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Here is a study on Ssri Increasing cortisol http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=23509222

Yes, but the study shows the acute effect after injecting liquid citalopram for 2 hours. The chronic effects are different. Take one SSRI pill and after about 30 minutes serotonin activity increases. Take one SSRI pill a day for several weeks and serotonin synthesis and expression is reduced, in some brain regions to less than half the baseline. See: Serotonin: The 'chemical imbalance' myth

In addition to the three studies I linked to in my last post see also: Hinkelmann K, 2012; Knorr U, 2012 and Piwowarska J, 2012. I could find you many more, but life is short so I'll let you search the PubMed data base if you feel the need for more.

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Do all antidepressants have the abilty to cause Bone Loss i ask as I had a bone density Scan which showed Osteopenia in spine and didnt want to make it any worse ?

Probably. But so do stress/anxiety and also depression. The antidepressant-bone loss link is still controversial. I suggest you seek advice from a specialist in the field. IMHO, treating osteoporosis is more important to the outcome than whether antidepressants do and don't exacerbate bone loss a bit more or less than the stress induced disorders they're treating.

Ian

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NOTE: I'm not a doctor, and particularly not yours, so there may be factors I'm unaware of. Therefore all advice is of a general nature and you should consult your doctor before following any of it, especially before changing med doses.

Offline Abraham2007

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Re: Adrenal Fatigue & Anxiety ?
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2014, 11:28:48 PM »
Hi Ian Thanks for Replying, Is the any studies that Show that stress Hormones Cause Long term Damage to the hippocampal Areas of The Brain ?

Ian posted another good link to Wikipedia in another thread from azzmattaz06.  That link referenced the brain's Limbic system. In relation to your question anxio0us J (which I colored in red), Wikipedia further states (in my form of summary, however I pasted the exact excepts from Wikipedia below):

Repeated exposure to stress causes long term damage to the hippocampal areas of the brain,
and this damage affects emotional processing, even mating on how you encounter people you are romantically interested in, your level of trust with others, and your ability to learn.  All of these are many of the symptoms, which are the foundation of an anxiety disorder, which are caused by prolonged stress to the brain.

Really good stuff, Ian.   :happy0151:

Steve
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Hippocampal damage

Damage relayed to the hippocampal region of the brain has reported vast effects on overall cognitive functioning, particularly memory such as spatial memory. As previously mentioned, spatial memory is a cognitive function greatly intertwined with the hippocampus. While damage to the hippocampus may be a result of a brain injury or other injuries of that sort, researchers particularly investigated the effects that high emotional arousal and certain types of drugs had on the recall ability in this specific memory type. In particular, in a study performed by Parkard,[18] rats were given the task of correctly making their way through a maze. In the first condition, rats were stressed by shock or restraint which caused a high emotional arousal. When completing the maze task, these rats had an impaired effect on their hippocampal-dependent memory when compared to the control group,. Then, in a second condition, a group of rats were injected with anxiogenic drugs. Like the former these results reported similar outcomes, in that hippocampal-memory was also impaired. Studies such as these reinforce the impact that the hippocampus has on memory processing, in particular the recall function of spatial memory. Furthermore, impairment to the hippocampus can occur from prolonged exposure to stress hormones such as Glucocorticoids (GCs), which target the hippocampus and cause disruption in explicit memory.[19]

Social processing

Social processing is an area of cognition specific to the amygdala. To be specific, the evaluation of faces in social processing is of particular importance. In a study done by Todorov,[22] fMRI tasks were performed with participants to evaluate whether the amygdala was involved in the general evaluation of faces. After the study, Todorov concluded from his fMRI results that the amygdala did indeed play a key role in the general evaluation of faces. However, in a study performed by researchers Koscik[23] and his team, the trait of truthworthiness was particularly examined in the evaluation of faces. They investigated how brain damage to the amygdala played a role in truthworthiness, and found that individuals that suffered damage tended to confuse trust and betrayal, and thus placed trust in those having done them wrong. So Koscik demonstrated that the amygdala was involved in evaluating the truthworthiness of an individual. Yet, a man named Rule,[24] along with his colleagues, expanded on the idea of the amygdala in its critique of truthworthiness in others and performed a study in 2009 in which he examined the amygdala in its role of evaluating general first impressions and relating them to real-world outcomes with his study involving first impressions of CEOs. Rule demonstrated that while the amygdala did play a role in the evaluation of truthworthiness, as observed by Koscik in his own research two years later in 2011, the amygdala played a generalized role in the overall evaluation of first impression of faces. This latter conclusion, along with Todorov’s study on the amygdala’s role in general evaluations of faces and Koscik’s research on truthworthiness and the amygdala, further solidified evidence that the amygdala plays a role in overall social processing.

Attentional and emotional processes


Besides memory, the amygdala also seems to be an important brain region involved in attentional and emotional processes. First, to define attention in cognitive terms, attention is the ability to hone in on some stimuli while ignoring others. Thus, the amygdala seems to be an important structure in this ability. Foremost, however, this structure was historically thought to be linked to fear, allowing the individual to take action to rid that fear in some sort. However, as time has gone by, researchers such as Pessoa,[21] generalized this concept with help from evidence of EEG recordings, and concluded that the amygdala helps an organism to define a stimulus and therefore respond accordingly. However, when the amygdala was initially thought to be linked to fear, this gave way for research in the amygdala for emotional processes. Kheirbek[14] demonstrated research that the amygdala is involved in emotional processes, in particular the ventral hippocampus. He described the ventral hippocampus as having a role in neurogenesis and the creation of adult-born granule cells (GC). These cells not only were a crucial part of neurogenesis and the strengthening of spatial memory and learning in the hippocampus but also appear to be an essential component in the amygdala. A deficit of these cells, as Pessoa (2009) predicted in his studies, would result in low emotional functioning, leading to high retention rate of mental diseases, such as anxiety disorders.
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Offline anxious J

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Re: Adrenal Fatigue & Anxiety ?
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2014, 06:34:26 AM »
Thanks for the Studies , So How long can one expect the hippocampus to regrow these new brain cells ? Also once grown back considering things in your life have changed for the better would that mean You would be better to cope with Anxiety ?
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Offline insights

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Re: Adrenal Fatigue & Anxiety ?
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2014, 06:54:56 AM »
So How long can one expect the hippocampus to regrow these new brain cells ?

I'm not sure what the question is, but the hippocampi are, with the olfactory bulbs, the only areas of the brain which can grow new brain cells. It seems to be a life-long process.

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Also once grown back considering things in your life have changed for the better would that mean You would be better to cope with Anxiety ?

As a rule, anxiety disorders and depression are chronic conditions and antidepressants are treatments, not cures. So the odds are that the process will begin to slowly degrade once the meds are stopped. But it could take months or years. The cognitive/behavioural/mindfulness therapies may be as effective as meds in creating the conditions for neurogenesis, but they too are only treatments.

Ian
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NOTE: I'm not a doctor, and particularly not yours, so there may be factors I'm unaware of. Therefore all advice is of a general nature and you should consult your doctor before following any of it, especially before changing med doses.

Offline anxious J

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Re: Adrenal Fatigue & Anxiety ?
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2014, 12:51:43 PM »
So when stoping the meds Do the Brain/Body go back to functioning How it did Prior to the meds ? Also Do u No anything about Ssri Interrupting Rem Sleep  and Slow Wave Deep Sleep ? Is this just Start up side effects & Will it get better with time ? Thanks
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Offline insights

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Re: Adrenal Fatigue & Anxiety ?
« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2014, 03:43:51 PM »
So when stoping the meds Do the Brain/Body go back to functioning How it did Prior to the meds ?

Probably, though it may take some time, possibly years.

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Also Do u No anything about Ssri Interrupting Rem Sleep  and Slow Wave Deep Sleep ? Is this just Start up side effects & Will it get better with time ? Thanks

All antidepressant may affect sleep either by inducing insomnia or sedation. The SSRIs are more likely to induce insomnia, though some find them sedating. Sometimes insomnia is a temporary side-effect, but it can linger. There are ways of resolving it. Small doses of trazodone (Desyrel) are a common treatment for SSRI induced insomnia. It may reduce other SSRI side-effects too. Some find taking Benadryl at night produces enough sedation to given them a good nights sleep.

Ian
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NOTE: I'm not a doctor, and particularly not yours, so there may be factors I'm unaware of. Therefore all advice is of a general nature and you should consult your doctor before following any of it, especially before changing med doses.

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