Yikes!

[Knightsaber]

Anyone who is scared by withdrawal stories, physical symptoms or the fact that I have nasty things to say about Klonopin, should click the Back button :)

Okay....so.

Backstory: Psychiatrist and I worked for many moons to try to help relieve my anxiety/panic.  Not much worked.  Prozac, nothing.  Wellbutrin, screaming nightmares.  Zoloft was okay but eventually stopped working after I'd been taking 200mg for a year or so.  Finally he handed me some Klonopin.  Keep in mind that I certainly did not know much of anything at all about benzo's then, but I sure as ---- do now!  I started on 0.5mg once a day.  It was okay, didn't help much, went up to 1mg.  I was better, not a lot, though.  Eventually it ended up at 2mg a day.  Worked fantastically (at the time).  I took it for four years.  That is a long time to take a drug that is suggested to be prescribed for only 9 weeks.  And this is why....

Last month: Old psychiatrist went a little mad (seriously) and retired.  New psychiatrist says 'klonopin is bad, mmmkay'. I say 'okay'.  He says 'stop taking it.

Yes, yes he said this.  Stop taking it.

I asked if it should be tapered off, he said no.  Then he asked how many I had left.  I said seven.  He said cut them in half and take half (that would be 1mg) a day for a week, then cut the rest in half again and do that for a week.  So I did, had seven 0.5mg 'quarter' pieces left.  Then I went a week without.  Then another.  I felt okay, a little more anxious is all.  I was unconcerned.

Last week, was standing out in the yard talking to my dad.  Out of nowhere, with no warning, no signs of anything coming on, I threw up violently and fainted on the spot.  It was not hot outside, I was not doing anything I don't normally do.  Being the hypochondiac I am, I went to the doctor (regular M.D.).  He thought it was likely hypoglycemia (which actually would explain a lot, if you are familiar with the symptom list).  The next day, I had the following problems:

Light sensitivity.
Blurred vision.
Tremors in both hands (by tremors I mean good freakin luck picking anything up).
Heat flashes.
Tremendous dizziness.
Random thought patterns.
Absolutely no balance at all.
Completely weak legs and arms.
Terrible neck pain.
Such bad nausea I thought I was on a leaky boat in the Pacific.
And to top it off, I was as white as a sheet.

Okay, so this is all bad.  Unfortunately this was just this past Friday, and the doctor was out.  I refused to go to the ER.  Being that I am a hypochondriac, I avoid the ER whenever possible to reinforce my thinking with the point that I don't need to keep going there.  Unless there's blood involved and it drips, of course.

Suffered through Friday.  No sleep Friday night.

I suffered through Saturday, while unbelievably, getting much, much worse.

Sunday morning (less than 24 hours past), I was sitting upright in bed and fainted.  When I woke up, I had a little to eat just to see if it really was blood sugar.  Nope.  Lay back down and fainted again.  Started dry heaving and all sorts of unpleasantness.  The room was spinning like I was drunk as all ----.  I assure you I was not drunk :)

I know it breaks my Golden #1 Cardinal Rule, but when I was able to move a bit, I Googled it.  Not just a little, I typed in that box every single thing I could think of that I felt during the last week.

First Result:

Acute Klonopin Withdrawal.

Okay, I say, at least that makes sense.  Even to me :)  So, I did what any sane person should have done, I broke out four quarters of the klonopin tablets and down they went.  My normal 2mg dose. 

Twenty minutes later, I was fine.  F-i-n-e. Fine.  Nothing at all wrong.  No dizziness, no lightheadedness, no nausea, no pain, no fainting spells, no vomiting, no room spinning, no heat flashes, no nothing.  Nothing.

Now I have to figure out what I do next.

[gloomy]

I am sorry to hear this Knightsaber, especially as it was working, but I guess you will get through this one way or another.  Do you think you will need to stay on the benzos for good now?  Or fo you want to have another go at coming off them?  I only took diazepam for 2 weeks and it was bad withdrawal, but just to be balanced SSRI's can have nasty withdrawal too.  Its so unfair we think we have found something to help with the anxiety and then realise it comes with a price.

I guess this is a classic case of benzo addiction and subsequent withdrawal through no fault of your own.

I really hope things improve for you and there is an answer to this.

[Knightsaber]

My guess is that I'll end up on them for good.  Not that I enjoy this fact, but the withdrawal seems to hit me slightly hard.  You'd think I'd quit heroin cold turkey or something.

[gloomy]

Well as the saying goes if you were diabetic you wouldnt think twice about taking insulin for the rest of your life.  so if needs be then benzos forever might not be all that bad especially if they enable you to live relatively normally.

I wonder if people knew about SSRI and Benzo withdrawal before hand if they would think twice about taking them?  But then again I have weaned off Effexor before (horrific is an understatement) and still went running back after 6 months to go back on meds.  I guess everything has its price.  I have accepted I will probably always need some sort of medication now and I dont worry about it anymore.

[apple]

First of all I would find a new doc.  YOu should never quit a benzo or anti-depressant cold turkey...escpecially when you were on it for so long.  You may need to stay on them, or find another drug to work on your anxiety then SLOWELY wean off your benzo.

Tuff position your in...and yes the thought of searching for a new med when this one is working is absolutely scary.

Whatever you do I hope it works out in the end.  Sorry you went thru so much awful withdrawls.  Did you talk to your doc about what happened to you when you went off and took the last ones?  Your doc should know about these bad withdrawls and help you.

Keep us updated babe

[ocdengineer]

Knightsaber,

I am sooo sorry to hear of your nightmare scenario!  I first want to say that to stop 2mg of Klonopin in that manner is absolutely ridiculous and your doctor should be reprimanded at the very least for telling you to do so.  That is was an irresponsible and dangerous thing to do to a patient and probably worth of a law suit.  I really think you should consider finding a doctor who is capable of helping you and not inadvertently sending you to the ER!  I am not a doctor and I even know that that was recipe for disaster.

If you want to stop taking the Klonopin, you can do it, but you must take it much slower than your doctor said!  It could take months.  I would consider going down a quarter of a mg every two weeks and play it by how you are feeling.  If you aren't feeling good at 1.5 mg stay there for a few weeks until your body has time to adjust.  Now, if you get to 1 mg or whatever and your body doesn't seem to adjust then there is a good possibility that your original anxiety is rearing its ugly head again and in order to get off the drug completely you may have to face all of the horrible feelings you had before the drugs.  Your doctor could also give you another drug such as an SSRI while you are tapering so that it is working by the time you wean off the benzo.

I have resigned myself to the fact that I am better off on 2mg of Xanax, which is a benzo, and will stay on it for the rest of my days.  It really is the only thing that seems to work for me, but it is quite a decision to make since you now know what happens when you withdraw from a benzo.  Fortunately, I was aware of the withdrawl effects before I took it.  

Anyway, the reason that happened is because the Klonopin has reduced the need for your brain to produce GABA in your brain because synthetically it has been replacing it.  Over time your brain adjusts to the drug and creates a much smaller amount of GABA.  When you quit quickly, your brain could not possibly create enough GABA to replace what you just lost by stopping the benzo.  This is why you had the horrible reaction and why you need to take it very slow when stopping a benzo.

I wish you luck and again, kick that doctor to the curb.  He is a disgrace!

Take care,
OE

[King]

Hi Knightsaber

Why did the new psychiatrist tell you to stop taking the klonopin?

[Knightsaber]

No idea why he told me to stop.  My therapist works in the same building and his explanation was that 'this doctor doesn't prescribe anything potentially addictive'.  Well, he better start.

Problem is that I am in north central Iowa and there are not a lot of options in terms of doctors.  I don't know if I'll be able to get another prescription to wean off of it, and truth be told I'd rather not wean off of it.  It's the only thing that has ever worked for me.  Not even Xanax has touched my anxiety.  (up to 2mg)

No, I am not an abuser, in fact, some days I forgot to take it :)

This psychiatrist is more a fan of SSRI's (which I am still immune to 96.64% of) and will not prescribe Xanax, Ativan, Klonopin, even Ambien.

The thing that really burns me is when I saw the guy, he didn't even know why I was there.

[King]

Seems a strange decision. I'm generally anti-benzo (thats just my opinion) but there are always exceptions to every rule and as they say "if it aint broke, dont fix it".

You say there arent many options, but hopefully there are other psychiatrists out there you could try who can give you a balanced discussion, treat you like an adult and decide with you what is best for you.

Its not much help right now but the good news is that you probably wont need to be on a benzo the rest of your life like our forebears sometimes were. There are many new classes of drugs (unlike anything out today) being investigated for anxiety. So in 2-3 years I envisage you having another 4-5 new drug class types to have a go at, all of which will be more focused and specific in their action and safer (non-addictive or dependant) than current drugs.

So, as you know all too well, you just need something to keep you functioning and able to live your life in the meantime.

All the best, hope the other "options" work out
King

[ocdengineer]

The problem is Iowa isn't it?  There are few doctors probably that know much about anxiety disorders depending on where you live.  Are you seeing a GP or an anxiety disorder specialist?  If you are seeing a GP then I would definitely suggest you change doctors.  I still think it was a case of gross ignorance and neglect on your doctor's part.  I would be furious.  Something like that could potentially kill somebody.  Luckily, you just ended up in the ER for the night. 

I hope you find a doctor who will help you out on this one.  If not, I suggest you go to the ER ahead of time and get another prescription of Klonopin when you run out until you find another doctor who will treat you properly.

Take care,
OE

[Knightsaber]

GP tried to give me Zyprexa!

I objected almost violently.  I've seen my father on that, and he was constantly wiping the drool from his mouth and staring into space.  I very strongly suggested that if no one really wants me to be on Klonopin (and apparently they do not), then they could at least do me the courtesy of a proper benzo wean.

So I ended up with a 60 count of 1mg tablets of Klonopin.  2mg this week, then we'll try 1mg for three weeks, then .5 for three, then 0.25 for three, and hopefully I'll be able to get off of it then.

Honestly, I still could not tell you why after four years my doctors decided to change my medications, when it was working fine.

Yes, I know long term Klonopin is supposedly a bad thing (I couldn't tell you how, I try to avoid reading -too much- about it), but is it a bad thing when it prevents my horrific panic attacks?  Not in my opinion.  And to be honest, my panic attacks are abnormally severe.  Occasionally, even on the Klonopin and all, I need a liquid Ativan sedation in the ER, as my panic can go for well over three hours a pop.

I'm not enjoying this much at all.

Yes, the fact I'm in Iowa does not help.  The state frowns on benzo use and the like, doctors have been 'encouraged' not to prescribe it unless it's for seizure patients.

At least I have my function back.  I can still feel some lingering effects of the withdrawal, I hope they aren't permanent.

[ocdengineer]

The withdrawl effects are not permanant.  Maybe it is time to find another doctor.  Make a few calls and see if you can find someone who is a bit more benzo friendly.  I think what you will find is that as you wean off the Klonopin, at some point along the way you will reach a point where the anxiety and panic will be back and you will have to deal with that again.  I suggest looking into CBT and other relaxation techniques to help you through this time and even enlist a therapist (CBT preferably).  If you are forced to wean off the benzo then make sure that you are able to deal with the anxiety when it is back in your lap. 

Also, what is your official diagnosis?  If it is a simple anxiety disorder, then Zyprexa is ridiculous.  I took Zyprexa once as well and your description is about right.  I could not function as a human on that stuff.  It literally turned me into a zombie and on top of all that, the anxiety was still there!

This may be a good chance for you to turn to some alternative methods of dealing with panic, such as meditation, CBT, exercise, healthy eating, etc. and see where you really stand on the anxiety scale without meds. 

If it doesn't work out then at least you know what works and you will have to find a doctor who can help you.

I hope it all works out for ya,
OE

[apple]

I was ok on zyprexa altho it hurt my stomach.  I am now on riperdal 2mg and doing very well.  How much zyprexa was you and your dad taking?  Maybe thats why the effects were so bad if it was high?? I dont know.  I was on 1.5mg which is very low but effective.  I dont know if another anti-psychotic like risperdal would be an option for you.  Everyone is different and maybe it's not for you but thought I would let you know about it.

I hope you get this figured out.  I know my doc didnt want me to stay on the risperdal so kept weening me off and onto another drug.  After a few BAD experiences with other drugs, he felt ok with me going on the risperdal and staying on it.  At least I was taking my med...and I wasnt layed up in bed.  Maybe if the doc sees you can not handle other meds he would be inclined to give you your klonopin. 

[King]

Please remember that people will have varying doses of Zyprexa depending on why they receive it - its dose for anxiety/depression would be different from that for negative and postive symptoms of psychosis.

I dont know what medical condition you have Knightsaber, but one drug to consider in the future is Seroquel (quetiapine) which is in the final stages of getting a licence for GAD and depression (at lower dose than for bipolar or psychosis). Its might to be very good because it works on dopamine and serotonin, and is very good at stabilising mood. Most antipsychotics dont work on serotonin directly. And it doesnt work like a SSRI either.

Something to perhaps think about if other options are not suitable/work.

[Knightsaber]

The withdrawl effects are not permanant.  Maybe it is time to find another doctor.  Make a few calls and see if you can find someone who is a bit more benzo friendly.  I think what you will find is that as you wean off the Klonopin, at some point along the way you will reach a point where the anxiety and panic will be back and you will have to deal with that again.  I suggest looking into CBT and other relaxation techniques to help you through this time and even enlist a therapist (CBT preferably).  If you are forced to wean off the benzo then make sure that you are able to deal with the anxiety when it is back in your lap. 

Also, what is your official diagnosis?  If it is a simple anxiety disorder, then Zyprexa is ridiculous.  I took Zyprexa once as well and your description is about right.  I could not function as a human on that stuff.  It literally turned me into a zombie and on top of all that, the anxiety was still there!

This may be a good chance for you to turn to some alternative methods of dealing with panic, such as meditation, CBT, exercise, healthy eating, etc. and see where you really stand on the anxiety scale without meds. 

If it doesn't work out then at least you know what works and you will have to find a doctor who can help you.

I hope it all works out for ya,
OE

Seven years of CBT did nothing.  Relaxation techniques are about the only way for me to fall asleep at night.  Exercise doesn't do much except scare me more, and healthy eating has lost me about 110 lbs but no anxiety change.  I've seen people on Zyprexa and refuse it.  I think it's as good a thing as shock therapy for mental issues.  Which means bad :)

My official diagnosis is pretty lengthy, I think there's a board on here for each line of my file.  Panic disorder, hypochondria, Asperger's Syndrome (which I actually disagree with, but enforces the fact that it's likely true), major depression (I'd like to see 'minor' depression someday), and PTSD.  Twelve years of trying various methods and medications to relieve any of my panic and the only two things that have -ever- worked are Klonopin and a shot of Ativan when I really need a nice sedation.  I haven't had that in a few years, though.

So unless they can find something new that works without turning me into a vegetable, I'll put up with being called names like 'addict' and 'junkie' and just keep the Klonopin, thanks.

[ocdengineer]

So, what has happened?  Did you switch docs?

Later,
OE

[Knightsaber]

Not a lot has happened besides the doc recognizing the bad way withdrawal was treating me and putting me back on 1mg instead of 2mg.  It's still really lousy but better.

I see him again next week, and it's now known for sure that I won't allow him to push me around anymore.

[ocdengineer]

Well, I hope it all works out for you.  That can be a real hassle. 

Good luck,
OE